I have a FOIA question.
As many of you know I’m tutoring high school physics. I have students from several different schools. Each school uses a somewhat different method of teaching physics, goes at different paces and so on. Naturally, I am curious to know the distribution of outcomes on the final AP Physics exams at each school.
Motivated by curiosity, I wanted to see what sorts of reports schools get and found this:
Report Descriptions.
I think the Five-Year School Summaries contain the information I would be curious about. (I’m only curious about AP Physics scores, though there may be other people curious about other courses.)
Do you people think anonymized scores for AP Physics tests is something that would be accessible under FOIA? (This is assuming the school downloaded them from the college board and retained them, which I think most would.)
Real question btw. Of course you are also free to discuss whether such a request would be useful, obnoxious and so on. ( I am perfectly aware that many teachers will consider it obnoxious. How their students did on standardized tests in their classes is something teachers typically don’t want the public to access because they feel people rate teachers this way. Of course teachers aren’t wrong about this. That said: I’m still curious. My reasons are not really rating teachers, but more that I would like to know how students in Illinois really do do, especially those in my county. )
Anyway, my main question right now is whether it’s something that I ought to be able to get with a sufficiently carefully worded request?
Open thread.
Lucia,
Getting data from multiple school districts is hard for issues of both privacy and wide dissemination. Too many hurdles to jump.
The College Board is a private organization and I would guess they aren’t subject in any way to FOIA requests. However, they have a research unit that may agree to provide anonymized data (possibly at some cost) if your request is reasonable (as defined by them, of course). A research proposal is the request most likely to be granted, especially if they can use the results to help their business, which after all, is selling a testing service. Plain curiosity probably won’t get you far, but as a tutor looking to improve the work you do with students, you might be given some data. It’s worth inquiring if you can make a case.
Lucia,
I agree with Gary. You will never get the information you want from the school districts. The best chance is via the College Board. Even there, I suspect the chance is slim. Too political a subject.
Gary,
I would not FOIA the college board. FOIA won’t apply to them because they aren’t a government agency.
I’m honestly guessing that the college board would never give it out. It’s not a good business move for them. (I know some people like to think non-profits aren’t “businesses”. But really, it sort of is one.)
WRT to AP, the college board business models is getting parents to pay for tests. But parents pay for tests mostly after kids take AP classes at high schools. High school teachers will not want the tests to be used to “judge” them. Most really don’t like the idea that people would know how their students are doing in the aggregate. This is just not the sort of information schools want people to really know.
The way I see it the only way to get this is from schools and the only way to get it from them would be to FOIA. That will only work if FOIA applies to it. If it doesn’t, then I’m never going to get the info.
Illinois FOIA does apply to our public high school records of various sorts. But there are some things you can’t get. I guess I’m going to have to re-read a few times.
I’m mostly just curious. I don’t want to be tooooo obnoxious. On the other hand…. I don’t mind being obnoxious sometimes.
I’m looking into it… and I’m going to keep some notes here.
Some interpretation of exemption from Il. FOIA:
https://www.rcfp.org/illinois-open-government-guide/ii-exemptions-and-other-legal-limitations/exemptions-open-records-s-4
I think this would suggest I could get AP scores provided I don’t get students names. (I don’t want their names.)
Thought I would pass along this interesting comment from my 16-year-old son tonight. He really doesn’t like AP Physics. (His career plans don’t include the sciences. I even offered him $500 to try to get an “A” just to see if he had an interest, and he didn’t. Would have raised it to $1,000 if I had seen a glimmer of interest.) However, he said that the physics has helped him in science and another subject, which escapes me.
Also, he is going through an interesting progression on the ACT. Started off with a 23. After a prep course, he scored 25. (In both cases, he said that the material wasn’t that hard, he was just not finishing it.) Since then by reading marketing books his reading speed has increased, and he has developed strategies to finish, and he is scoring 29 to 34 on about 6 or 7 practice tests.
JD
AP Physics teaching seems to be uneven. That said: regardless of what grade he earns, if he can get a 4 or 5 on the AP tests, he can probably escape taking some science classes at University. If he hates science, never having to take it again could be a motivation!
I know the SAT is very coachable. I’ve heard ACT less so. But… 29-34 is very respectable.